GSD..... or ... alsatian

i always thought the two were the same thing..... ..

whilst looking up info about something else...i got this up........

very long winded,but definately makes for an interesting read


http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/bulletins_read/260945.html

I havent read all of it but as far as I'm aware, there are no "alsatians" anymore anyway, hasnt been since the KC changed their name back to the GSD so this makes no sense anyway.

Will have a proper read through it later but from what I gather, these are people who only like "one look" to a GSD and are saying any other looks should be split off and called an "alsatian" as in their view its a substandard dog frowned upon.

I never know what to think about this sort of thing, many breeds look nothing like how they used to, some I would not even class as the same breed by sight, ie the bullmastiff 70 years ago looks nothing at all like Maggie :nhy:

Yet, evolution changes things. People dont look the same as they used to either so is it right to keep a breed how it used to be or should change be welcomed?

Personally, I think many breeds should be bred back to how they used to look before we had crufts and the suchlike which focusses too much on looks over everything else but am I wrong to want that??? It makes me think of Hitler and arians.

i agree paula.. a dog should be left as it originally was... ....

the show side interests me... and i love reading some of the stuff on ped database... when i remember about it lolol....

each to their own i spose... if we all liked things the same way... thier would be no competition and things would be boring, or would they lol

www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article5536800.ece

Breeding for Show Causes Stupid Dogs

THE desire of pet owners for attractive-looking dogs has eroded the mental agility and alertness of the working breeds from which they are descended, researchers have suggested.

Only a century ago, guard dogs had to protect houses or livestock, and gun dogs needed to find and pick up dead birds to justify their upkeep.

Now, however, their descendants are merely required to look attractive. The behaviour expected of them is to be friendly and docile at home, rather than alert and aggressive outside.

Scientists in Sweden have found strong evidence that breeding modern dogs for their appearance has led to a decline in intelligence.

A separate group of researchers from Lincoln University is to investigate whether this is linked to the dogs’ loss of a working role. Pilot studies suggest so-called working breeds perform particularly badly in tests of attentiveness and responsiveness.

Kenth Svartberg, author of the Swedish research, said the changes in intelligence had happened over just a few generations.

“Modern breeding practices are affecting the behaviour and mental abilities of pedigree breeds as well as their physical features,” he said.

Researchers believe too many breeders are now concentrating on outward aspects and ignoring the mental qualities of dogs to appeal to modern pet owners and the dog shows that dictate the characteristics of pure breeds.

The trend has been exacerbated by inbreeding.

Pedigree bulldogs, for example, often have genetic defects that lead to skin and coat problems, breathing disorders, joint problems and cleft palates.

Svartberg, who carried out his research at Stockholm University, gave 10 tests to 13,000 dogs to rate 31 breeds on characteristics such as sociability and curiosity.

He found that, in general, animals that were bred for appearance, and especially for shows, displayed reduced levels of all these qualities.

The worst affected breeds included smooth collies and rhodesian ridgebacks. These showed low interest in exercises to test their curiosity and sociability and were also likely to walk away from a strange object.

Svartberg found there were also variations within breeds according to what the particular dogs had been bred for.

He said attractive appearance was often linked with introversion and a boring personality.

“Perhaps the genes behind attractive looks could also be closely linked [on the same chromosome] to those that cause fearfulness,” he said.

This was an interesting post though. I bet Fazza will have something to say about the last paragraph

and this ...''Pilot studies suggest so-called working breeds perform particularly badly in tests of attentiveness and responsiveness.''

I'm still reading through the thread and taking it all in, will be back with more unpopular views of my own later

:2431: ... ive not read it all yet,...too busy searching about lol...
look forward to your opinion popular or unpopular hun... i prob wont understand them either way :san42: ....cos most of it goes over the top of me head :2431:

the name Alsation was only given to the German Shepherd at the start of world war 1 then changed back at the end of world war 2. so basically they are the same

before world war 1 there was no such animal as Alsation. so the history books say anyway

Thats what I thought Karen. It seems, the UK KC has now added Alsatian in brackets to a GSD, gonna have a look now....

liverbird@home wrote:

the name Alsation was only given to the German Shepherd at the start of world war 1 then changed back at the end of world war 2. so basically they are the same

before world war 1 there was no such animal as Alsation. so the history books say anyway

thats what i always believed too, thats why i got confused lol :2431:

Paula wrote:

http://www.thekennelclub.org.uk/item/136

it has alsatian in brackets on freds pedigree papers too

Oh, I didnt know they used the name at all, I thought they just changed it then changed it back, shows what I know :2445: :2445:

Name
The breed was named Deutscher Schäferhund by Von Stephanitz, literally translating to "German Shepherd Dog". The breed was so named due its original purpose of assisting shepherds in herding and protecting sheep. At the time, all other herding dogs in Germany were referred to by this name; they thus became known as Altdeutsche Schäferhunde or Old German Shepherd Dogs. Shepherds were first exported to Britain in 1908, and the UK Kennel Club began to recognise the breed in 1919.

The direct translation of the name was adopted for use in the official breed registry; however, at the conclusion of World War I, it was believed that the inclusion of the word "German" would harm the breed's popularity,[12] due to the anti-German sentiment of the era.[13] The breed was officially renamed by the UK Kennel Club to "Alsatian Wolf Dog"[a][12] which was also adopted by many other international kennel clubs. Eventually, the appendage "wolf dog" was dropped.[12] The name Alsatian remained for five decades,[12] until 1977, when successful campaigns by dog enthusiasts pressured the British kennel clubs to allow the breed to be registered again as German Shepherd Dogs.[2]

some interesting stuff in this..........

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_Shepherd_Dog

i wiki everything lolol.... its brill :2431:

I thought the same about the name "Alsation" came from the British due to the war.
I think everyone has their own opinion on the "type" they like.

I wiki everything..... google and wiki!!!

the name was given so we were not seen using anything german basically from what i know its a f**king name nothing to do with type lol now ppl call the long haired ones or eng bred ones allys and the west german show lines GSD's as show ppl think that their standard is the only right one PIFT lol

im gonna be sooo conterversial now lol a GSD was bred for work not prancing around looking pretty lol as much as show ppl like to tell me my kiera isnt a GSD as she isnt to "type" well F ME do i care cos she is a true GSD shes got a nice strong back end no angulation is quite small social but alert and always ready. one of the best working dogs i have ever owned

you cannot tell me that a dog that used to be the shape of a mali and just as light, had the best temperment going, hasnt been damaged by show breeders and BYB ?? sorry just my opinion but i like my dogs arse off the ground and why do you want such angulation for a certain gait WTF dont ppl just stop playing God ?? i could stack kiera and she still wouldnt look like a show dog in a show stance. sorry the more i hear show ppl drone on the more im switching off to them they sound lke Hitler FFS lol

i agree we dont all need dogs with high drives but a nice straight back would be a first and dogs with out nervous issues too.

my working lab looks nothing like a show lab or flabrador as i like to call them show breeders have rueind that breed how can a fat over weight stumpy legged dog jump a six foot fence and retrieve game over and over ...??? they cant nor do they want to lol i have friends with 3 show labs and one worker and they rescued the show ones as their breeders didnt want them any more no use for them and one was a crufts champ!

:walk the dogs: