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PostSubject: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   GSD community hits back at Kennel Club Icon_minitimeFri Feb 12, 2010 4:42 pm

this is a very long post but it might interest some on here
and Mo Lakin (Mascani) has added a comment too

GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 910222

GSD community hits back at Kennel Club

THE
KENNEL Club has spoken out again this week on the German Shepherd Dog
debate, and said that a vocal minority within the breed are continuing
to distract attention from the KC’s main concerns regarding soundness
in the breed.

In the statement, which was
issued to the press on Monday morning, the KC said that it remained in
no doubt that currently the single biggest threat to the reputation and
interest of the breed is the lack of soundness in hindquarters,
particularly the hocks.

The release continued: ‘The presence of this unsoundness in GSDs is
generally recognised by most people in dogs except by some with vested
interests in the GSD breed, who steadfastly refuse to acknowledge that
there is a problem in this area. The Kennel Club remains frustrated
that something so patently obvious to many dog people - even those with
a limited knowledge of dogs - is being ignored and denied by some
people in the breed. Indeed the recent Bateson Inquiry singled out the
GSD as an example of a breed ‘where drastic action is required’ to
address conformation and movement.

‘The GSD community has commendably introduced a number of valuable
voluntary health testing schemes addressing issues such as haemophilia,
hip dysplasia and others. The Kennel Club has supported this voluntary
testing and will continue to support all responsible breeders who put
the health of their animals first. These tests are undeniably
important, but crucially they do not address the most important current
issue – lack of soundness in the hindquarters and hocks.’
However, the GSD Partnership immediately hit back, saying that there
had been no attempt from anyone in the GSD community to distract
attention from any matter that impacts on the health issues of the
breed. In its reply, the Partnership stated: ‘The Kennel Club is well
aware from the long discussions that have taken place with the GSD
Partnership, that the issue of soundness in the hocks is one which has
been acknowledged as requiring particular attention. They have chosen
to ignore the representation from the Partnership as the collective
group who represent all the GSD Clubs and go direct to the clubs.’

However, the Kennel Club says that the GSD Partnership has repeatedly
claimed that the Kennel Club is not accepting its proposed Breed
Improvement Programme and its requests that the Programme forms the
basis of a mandatory requirement for showing and breeding. The fact
remains, accorting to the KC, that no part of the proposed Programme
acknowledges, let alone addresses, the issue of soundness in the
hindquarters and hocks.

David Payne of the Videx GSD told OUR DOGS: ‘I can categorically state
the GSD breed has been tackling unsoundness of the hocks for many
decades. This problem can never be eliminated, it needs controlling, in
a similar way hip dysplasia and other diseases cannot be eliminated but
need controlling. The GSD breed does not need lectures, threats, or
intimidation from the Kennel Club on the subject of unsound hocks or
any other health screening issues. The Kennel Club can be taught a huge
amount on these issues by the GSD fraternity.’

Fundamental
The
Kennel Club says it believes that the health and soundness of dogs
should be the fundamental and overriding concern of breeders. The
improvement of soundness in the GSD lies with GSD breeders, owners and
judges all working towards the same goal. The judge’s role is a vital
one in the development of many aspects of a breed, but one of their
primary responsibilities is to ensure that unsound dogs are not
rewarded in the show ring.

‘This issue of
soundness is not a simple difference of opinion, it is the fundamental
issue of the breed’s essential conformation and movement,’ the KC said.

All GSD breed clubs have been asked by the Kennel Club to sign a formal
Undertaking that ‘accepts that there is a degree of unsoundness in the
hindquarters of the breed and in particular in the hocks of some dogs
and that these problems are to be penalised at shows.’ They have
further been asked to undertake positive action to address this
unsoundness issue. The KC says that GSD owners and breeders have the
chance now to make a positive impact on the future of their breed by
supporting the Kennel Club’s measures to address this essential factor.
Owners and breeders should make their views known to the breed clubs
that represent them and ask that the Undertakings be signed for the
future protection and welfare of this breed.

Joe Summerhill, GSD Partnership co-ordinator remains unconvinced: ‘It
is amazing that the KC still say the GSD Partnership and Community are
doing nothing about their concern when on the 21st November 2009 the
GSDP held a forum attended by over 100 GSD enthusiasts who debated the
issue and confirmed to the KC in writing on the 26th November 2009 that
they acknowledged their issue and, among other initiatives, agreed to
run a Judges seminar to highlight the point.
‘It is intriguing that the KC has not responded to the letter despite
two reminders, as to do so would clearly undermine their current
tactics of falsely stating that there has been no action from the GSD
Community. Some members of the GSD Community are looking forward to
alternative showing of demonstrably healthy animals who have passed
mandatory health tests, outside the KC control.

‘The KC have been put under notice by both the APGAW and Bateson
reports that if the KC does not impose mandatory health requirements
for dogs they register then other organisations will. It has started.

‘The time for the KC to realise they are overseeing a business critical
period in their existence and that to simply push mandatory health
requirement “upstairs” by lobbying the government is a tactic that may
ultimately see them lose the position they currently uniquely have.
Alternative registration initiatives and showing of dogs outside KC
licensed shows for animals who have passed mandatory health
requirements for their breed has started and will continue as long as
the KC continue on avoiding the opportunity they have to change.

‘We have again this week written to ask for a meeting on the KCs
progress on implementing Mandatory health restrictions for all KC
registered pedigree GSDs.’

Undesirable
Mo Lakin of the Mascani GSDs, told OUR DOGS: ‘ Firstly, I would comment that this is the first time I have ever seen the KC write any issue on our breed that has not had the word (Alsation) in brackets after its
name. The KC speaks of a vocal minority attempting to distract from the
issue on unsoundness - and this being the Kennel Club’s main concern!
Now we are talking turkey!


‘Unsoundness is
really undesirable, and there is not a breeder in the land that would
say otherwise. but what percentage of the breed is the Kennel Club
considering to be unsound? All of them? 50% - 25% - all show dogs? They
are all being promoted in some way or another by the K.C, are they
registering these dogs? Are they going to continue to register these
dogs, once found? Can they de-register a dog that becomes unsound -
what about the veteran classes and our lovely oldies coming out for the
day? the kennel club must behave in a more professional manner, this is
not about unsoundness, it is clearly being seen to be doing something
about some issue that doesn't cost you money on registrations. It’s
about bullying a set of pro-active people that are addressing health
issues much more than themselves, and not wanting to take an initiative
because it will cost too many registration fees.

‘The KC needs to address hip dysplasia. Stop registering un-scored or
unfavourable scores - give the puppy farmers something to worry about -
start making all the health tests that concerned and caring breeders
pay good money to do, count.

‘Also, the KC needs to get a grip of haemophilia, to make sure every
male dog has to be tested to be shown or used. The list goes on, but
that list costs registration money and "unsound" dogs have no
particular test to give a clinical overview - so our KC is safe - they
can register the newborns from us all, because there is never going to
be a test that can conclude that this dog should not be shown. There is
every opportunity to do that right now - cut the risk of hip dysplasia
right down - I put it to the KC to stop registering un-checked animals
- even give a date as to when this action will start - but make it
within our lifetime... then you will get credibility from the people
that really care and strive to do the right thing.

‘We are asked by the Kennel Club to sign a formal Undertaking that
‘accepts that there is a degree of unsoundness in the hindquarters of
the breed.’No clinical evidence, no percentages given? No proof that
the issue is as big as the KC would like the public to think to cover
its own tracks of instability on the health issue side of the GSD. No
thank you!

Passionate
‘The
letter was, in my opinion, a threat. it went severely wrong because we
are not people sitting in offices, we are people passionate about our
breed and have not taken the letter sitting down –many of us are
professional people in our own right and know the limits of conduct
and, as this letter has not given the result the KC thought it would,
is why you they are calling us vocal. The KC has found a little niche
in unsoundness and has played on it without giving us any answers.
‘The KC says that it supports the GSD community in their voluntary
health tests - and will continue to support us. How? It then goes on
the say that ‘These tests are undeniably important, but crucially they
do not address the most important current issue – lack of soundness in
the hindquarters and hocks.’ Where is the KC coming from? Have any of
them seen a dog or an owner in dire distress from dealing with hip
dysplasia or a status epilepticus? Have they seen a dog that has a
degree of unsoundness? Try to compare the two.

‘The GSD Partnership is a band of very well respected business people,
respected in all walks of life, except, it would seem by the KC. The KC
states: ‘This issue of soundness is not a simple difference of opinion,
it is the fundamental issue of the breed’s essential conformation and
movement.’ We agree. We also know that it is not 100% and rising, it is
a problem that is no more prevalent in our breed than in some others,
and a problem that can and is being dealt with by breeding programmes
and by surveying animals and of course hopefully by judging, although
the KC approve the judges.

‘Some of us in the breed are now saying OK, keep your CCs, because if
that’s our governing body, do we need it. The answer is no.

‘I personally feel that the letter is flawed and dictatorial. In the
main, GSD people are thrilled with the Bateson report, we have even
gone to the length of writing to Mr Bateson’s secretary to see how soon
it can be implemented.

‘I want to give the KC a challenge. Contact the Media - let us have a
serious debate with the best of the KC’s and the best of ours - let
there be a mediator, keeping us to health issues - I would talk to the
KC any day in front of Joe public and I would be happy to put my
concerns to the test.’
David Payne concluded: ‘The National GSD Breed Warden, Reinhardt Meyer,
of the SV in Germany, addressed a meeting of all GSD Breed judges
within Germany in January 2009 and told them that unsoundness of the
hocks (and GSD size) must be more strenuously dealt with and all judges
must penalise dogs so affected, by degree, and place them “down the
line” at shows. This “instruction” has resonated around the GSD world.

Hereditary
‘The
GSD world community, of which ‘we’ in the UK are very active members,
do not need the Kennel Club to bully our breed into submission on any
health issue. Our record is second to none. Can anyone imagine the GSD
breed, which introduced the BVA/KC hip scheme into the United Kingdom,
needing any lessons on health or apparent health issues related to the
German Shepherd Dog?

‘In my opinion, The
Kennel Club continues to attempt to distract from the most serious
health concerns of GSD and all Pedigree Dogs, which are proven
hereditary diseases, for which there are “health screening” available,
mainly through the British Veterinary Association (BVA).

‘Unsound hocks have no known health related diseases. They may, in the
extreme, cause premature tiredness in a working dog, and as such it
needs to be addressed, but unsound hocks are hardly in the same league
of health issues as Hip Dysplasia, Elbow Dysplasia, Haemophilia or
Juvenile Renal Dysplasia, all of which have scientific health screening
available.

‘As for the Kennel Club stating that the GSD Partnership (GSDP)
proposed “Planned Improvement Programme” (PIP) did not address the
issue of soundness in the hocks, this is complete nonsense. The GSDP
could very easily have included it, and the Kennel Club know this and
they could have asked for it to be included, they did not. The Kennel
Club simply failed to enter into meaningful discussions with the GSDP.

‘The Kennel Club are also failing, in my opinion, to satisfactorily
answer many very genuine concerns that have arisen from the
“undertaking” – apparently preferring GSD Clubs to sign under duress. I
have over 30 year of considerable knowledge and experience in the GSD
breed. I am a Championship Show Judge, I have judged our GSD breed
throughout the world, and written many articles on the breed.

‘I believe the Kennel Club has missed a golden opportunity to explore
and embrace many exciting proposals and ideas emanating from the GSD
community.’













































Last edited by liverbird on Fri Feb 12, 2010 4:56 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   GSD community hits back at Kennel Club Icon_minitimeFri Feb 12, 2010 4:51 pm

i saw something about this on fb....and then ems e-mailed it to me...

way to go mo mascanis and videx gsd's and many others who were there to support the good breeding of gsd's ... i dont understand it all that much tbh :2431:
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PostSubject: Re: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   GSD community hits back at Kennel Club Icon_minitimeFri Feb 12, 2010 4:54 pm

fredsmum wrote:
i saw something about this on fb....and then ems e-mailed it to me...

way to go mo mascanis and videx gsd's and many others who were there to support the good breeding of gsd's ... i dont understand it all that much tbh :2431:

GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 583730 nor me Shelley
i'm glad mine are pets tbh GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 910222
I couldn't be doing with all these long winded debates GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 393943
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PostSubject: Re: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   GSD community hits back at Kennel Club Icon_minitimeFri Feb 12, 2010 4:59 pm

I once contemplated showing fred .... im glad i didnt tbh... too much jargon for my liking....i barely understand any of it lol GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 583730 ...

theyre doing their best for the gsd breed though....so fair play to them... GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 910222
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PostSubject: Re: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   GSD community hits back at Kennel Club Icon_minitimeFri Feb 12, 2010 5:25 pm

GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 910222 deffo
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PostSubject: Re: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   GSD community hits back at Kennel Club Icon_minitimeSat Feb 13, 2010 12:05 am

GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 40512 David Payne cant half waffle

He does bring up great points about the GSD but his letters always go on forever GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 398987 i usually give up reading them half way through GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 398987 i lose the gist of what hes talking about after 10 minutes reading GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 398987

btw hes Keiras breeder Hes definately very knowledgable on the breed GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 910222
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PostSubject: Re: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   GSD community hits back at Kennel Club Icon_minitimeSat Feb 13, 2010 4:52 pm

:2431:
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PostSubject: Re: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   GSD community hits back at Kennel Club Icon_minitimeSat Feb 13, 2010 5:11 pm

GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 925943
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PostSubject: Re: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   GSD community hits back at Kennel Club Icon_minitimeSat Feb 13, 2010 8:35 pm

BrenA wrote:
GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 40512 David Payne cant half waffle

He does bring up great points about the GSD but his letters always go on forever GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 398987 i usually give up reading them half way through GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 398987 i lose the gist of what hes talking about after 10 minutes reading GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 398987

btw hes Keiras breeder Hes definately very knowledgable on the breed GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 910222

GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 732260 you old name dropper you GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 925943
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PostSubject: Re: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   GSD community hits back at Kennel Club Icon_minitimeSat Feb 13, 2010 8:41 pm

GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 925943 GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 925943 Hope he doesnt come on this site GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 457589
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PostSubject: Re: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   GSD community hits back at Kennel Club Icon_minitimeSat Feb 13, 2010 9:10 pm

GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 41621 GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 41621 GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 41621

GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 300576 what was his name again Bren
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PostSubject: Re: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   GSD community hits back at Kennel Club Icon_minitimeSat Feb 13, 2010 9:26 pm

GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 732260 GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 732260 You taking the piss Karen GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 157569
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PostSubject: Re: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   GSD community hits back at Kennel Club Icon_minitimeSat Feb 13, 2010 9:29 pm

who karen GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 989279 taking the piss GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 989279







thats all she does GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 457589 GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 457589
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PostSubject: Re: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   GSD community hits back at Kennel Club Icon_minitimeSat Feb 13, 2010 9:32 pm

BrenA wrote:
GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 732260 GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 732260 You taking the piss Karen GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 157569

GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 41621 GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 41621 GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 41621

GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 989279 who me GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 434936
i was thinking of inviting him on the forum Bren GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 41621
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PostSubject: Re: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   GSD community hits back at Kennel Club Icon_minitimeSat Feb 13, 2010 9:33 pm

fredsmum wrote:
who karen GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 989279 taking the piss GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 989279

thats all she does GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 457589 GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 457589
GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 903780
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PostSubject: Re: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   GSD community hits back at Kennel Club Icon_minitimeSat Feb 13, 2010 9:35 pm

GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 56081 GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 56081 GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 56081 Have you seen his posts on other sites GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 457589 GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 457589
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GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 228784
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GSD community hits back at Kennel Club Empty
PostSubject: Re: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   GSD community hits back at Kennel Club Icon_minitimeSat Feb 13, 2010 9:38 pm

BrenA wrote:
GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 56081 GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 56081 GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 56081 Have you seen his posts on other sites GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 457589 GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 457589

GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 300576

GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 910222 yes Bren i think i have















GSD community hits back at Kennel Club 243412


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GSD community hits back at Kennel Club Empty
PostSubject: Re: GSD community hits back at Kennel Club   GSD community hits back at Kennel Club Icon_minitime

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